Comments on: The Consuming Christian and the Consuming Church http://www.toddhiestand.com/the-consuming-christian-and-the-consuming-church/05/ Missional Living in Suburban America Wed, 17 Mar 2010 11:14:16 -0700 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.9.2 hourly 1 By: shared hearts | some strange ideas http://www.toddhiestand.com/the-consuming-christian-and-the-consuming-church/05/comment-page-1/#comment-41410 shared hearts | some strange ideas Mon, 12 May 2008 17:42:07 +0000 http://www.toddhiestand.com/?p=1050#comment-41410 [...] The Consuming Christian and the Consuming Church (Todd Hiestand) - Todd is a good friend, and my initial connection into the Ecclesia Network. I look forward to sharing more time together in the coming years. [...] [...] The Consuming Christian and the Consuming Church (Todd Hiestand) – Todd is a good friend, and my initial connection into the Ecclesia Network. I look forward to sharing more time together in the coming years. [...]

]]> By: Mike K http://www.toddhiestand.com/the-consuming-christian-and-the-consuming-church/05/comment-page-1/#comment-41334 Mike K Tue, 06 May 2008 19:40:43 +0000 http://www.toddhiestand.com/?p=1050#comment-41334 The large consumer-driven churches are becoming places where I find folks are becoming more and more dissatisfied. And because these churches are mostly consumer-driven, when the consumer becomes dissastified, he/she goes somewhere else. But I think if you look deeper into what makes some of these folks feel dissatisfied, you might find that this dissatisfaction may not be because their consumer needs are not met. Some folks are saying "something is wrong" from a deeper spiritual level that is not driven by consumer needs. Go I guess my point is...is that when folks come to visit The Well who seem disaffected by the current church models don't assume that they are wanting to leave because they are miffed because they don't like the music, the preaching, the lighting, or the newly-installed speed bumps in the parking lot (you know I couldn't have just made that last one up...), etc. Some may be dissatisfied, but they are looking for a place to grow into the kingdom people that they see themselves as and need to see a different model in which to make that happen. I have visited The Well and think for some folks who are of this mind, it could be the place for them. The large consumer-driven churches are becoming places where I find folks are becoming more and more dissatisfied. And because these churches are mostly consumer-driven, when the consumer becomes dissastified, he/she goes somewhere else.

But I think if you look deeper into what makes some of these folks feel dissatisfied, you might find that this dissatisfaction may not be because their consumer needs are not met. Some folks are saying “something is wrong” from a deeper spiritual level that is not driven by consumer needs.

Go I guess my point is…is that when folks come to visit The Well who seem disaffected by the current church models don’t assume that they are wanting to leave because they are miffed because they don’t like the music, the preaching, the lighting, or the newly-installed speed bumps in the parking lot (you know I couldn’t have just made that last one up…), etc. Some may be dissatisfied, but they are looking for a place to grow into the kingdom people that they see themselves as and need to see a different model in which to make that happen. I have visited The Well and think for some folks who are of this mind, it could be the place for them.

]]> By: Todd http://www.toddhiestand.com/the-consuming-christian-and-the-consuming-church/05/comment-page-1/#comment-41319 Todd Mon, 05 May 2008 14:58:49 +0000 http://www.toddhiestand.com/?p=1050#comment-41319 Yes John. that is exactly right. that's the key to a good church. Just make sure that you have a train that sometimes blares its horn during the service, a loud AC unit <em>inside</em> your building, industrial headers with loud fans, and an ambulance company on the other side of your wall that likes to watch movies really, really loudly... you have that and you have yourself an amazing church... Yes John. that is exactly right. that’s the key to a good church.

Just make sure that you have a train that sometimes blares its horn during the service, a loud AC unit inside your building, industrial headers with loud fans, and an ambulance company on the other side of your wall that likes to watch movies really, really loudly…

you have that and you have yourself an amazing church…

]]> By: john chandler http://www.toddhiestand.com/the-consuming-christian-and-the-consuming-church/05/comment-page-1/#comment-41318 john chandler Mon, 05 May 2008 14:32:00 +0000 http://www.toddhiestand.com/?p=1050#comment-41318 Thanks Todd, I appreciate the heart of what you get at here...hope it's something we can capture as well. So the first step is to get a cold, dank warehouse, right? Thanks Todd,
I appreciate the heart of what you get at here…hope it’s something we can capture as well. So the first step is to get a cold, dank warehouse, right?

]]> By: Todd http://www.toddhiestand.com/the-consuming-christian-and-the-consuming-church/05/comment-page-1/#comment-41317 Todd Mon, 05 May 2008 13:26:20 +0000 http://www.toddhiestand.com/?p=1050#comment-41317 Tim, feel free to come on out. Just don't consume.. :) ha! seriously though, i think the biggest thing that helps people learn this is that we aren't heavily programmed. If you want to become part of the community a) it just takes time b) you have to take a little initiative or at least accept an invitation when someone offers it (which we can always get better at). Also, another thing is that we try and constantly invite people to participation in what God is calling them to inside and outside of our community. Our constant challenge is shaping people who are able to hear and respond to that call. I hate the term getting "plugged in" too. In fact, i really hate it. A community is not some machine you can plug-into. Its a living, move organism. In fact, isn't the term plugged in a very consumer driven term? When you plug into something, its either using you or you are using it. Tim Keel had some great thoughts on the time it take to become part of a community and the idea of "plugged-in." I blogged about it here.. http://www.toddhiestand.com/are-you-plugged-in/11/ Tim, feel free to come on out. Just don’t consume.. :) ha!

seriously though, i think the biggest thing that helps people learn this is that we aren’t heavily programmed.

If you want to become part of the community a) it just takes time b) you have to take a little initiative or at least accept an invitation when someone offers it (which we can always get better at).

Also, another thing is that we try and constantly invite people to participation in what God is calling them to inside and outside of our community. Our constant challenge is shaping people who are able to hear and respond to that call.

I hate the term getting “plugged in” too. In fact, i really hate it. A community is not some machine you can plug-into. Its a living, move organism. In fact, isn’t the term plugged in a very consumer driven term? When you plug into something, its either using you or you are using it.

Tim Keel had some great thoughts on the time it take to become part of a community and the idea of “plugged-in.” I blogged about it here.. http://www.toddhiestand.com/are-you-plugged-in/11/

]]> By: Tim Etherington http://www.toddhiestand.com/the-consuming-christian-and-the-consuming-church/05/comment-page-1/#comment-41316 Tim Etherington Mon, 05 May 2008 13:15:16 +0000 http://www.toddhiestand.com/?p=1050#comment-41316 Todd, my first reaction when reading this was to plan on taking a long weekend and visiting The Well. :) Short of that, I'm curious. You said <i>New people learn quick (at least I hope they do) that if you are going to be part of The Well, we’re not going to live out your faith for you.</i> What does that look like? If you get a couple who show up and they like the music and the preaching but they don't "plug in" (I am not fond of that term) and just show up on Sunday mornings, what do you do? How would they either be moved to engage or to just move on? Just to be clear: I'm not doubting this, I'm curious what it looks like. Todd, my first reaction when reading this was to plan on taking a long weekend and visiting The Well. :)

Short of that, I’m curious. You said New people learn quick (at least I hope they do) that if you are going to be part of The Well, we’re not going to live out your faith for you. What does that look like? If you get a couple who show up and they like the music and the preaching but they don’t “plug in” (I am not fond of that term) and just show up on Sunday mornings, what do you do? How would they either be moved to engage or to just move on?

Just to be clear: I’m not doubting this, I’m curious what it looks like.

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